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Threaded | Newest First | Oldest First
 mpouraryan
8/22/2017 5:54:22 PM User Rank Platinum 
One "Humble "Suggestion....
Keep the customers in mind and keep the human element active...as I also leave you allw ith this:
 Ariella
8/23/2017 9:26:24 AM User Rank Author
Re: One "Humble "Suggestion....
@mpouraryan I specifically brought up the concerns over AI recently expressed by Musk and some others because that has made the headlines of late. The way Gilbert explains it, AI doesn't program itself to take actions it has thought of but to respond to new situations with the actions humans have planned out.
mpouraryan
8/23/2017 10:29:53 AM User Rank Platinum
Re: One "Humble "Suggestion....
I understand that @Ariella now--but the need to be vigiliant is paramount and this obsession with aotomation needs to be tempered. That's at the heart of the profound challenge we've got that I am glad is being debated as it is.
Ariella
8/23/2017 10:35:37 AM User Rank Author
Re: One "Humble "Suggestion....
@mpouraryan I agree absolutely that debate is healthy. People should raise concerns so that the industry is sure to take them into consideration in their plans for advancement.
mpouraryan
8/23/2017 10:42:50 AM User Rank Platinum
Re: One "Humble "Suggestion....
The challenge is to ensure that the industry is not "tone deaf" in its' quest to automate and discount the key "link" that makes it all possible--humans. It is still an open question--isn't it?
 afwriter
8/23/2017 11:46:50 PM User Rank Platinum
Re: One "Humble "Suggestion....
I know that it is a science fiction movie, but Facetime used to be science fiction. Terminator is a good example of what happens when computers start thinking for themselves. In real life, AI could make for some big problems long before they become androids.
mpouraryan
8/24/2017 12:01:18 AM User Rank Platinum
Re: One "Humble "Suggestion....
Y2K forced all to be read--that's why we survived it. By not having the debate now, we are kidding ourselves by thinking that somehow everything is going to be OK. We owe it to the future.
 srufolo1
8/24/2017 8:26:52 AM User Rank Platinum
Re: One "Humble "Suggestion....
@mpourayan My sister happens to think that AI is the biggest threat since the nuclear bomb. And she is quite intelligent. You're correct. Without a discussion, nothing will be done about it, whether the threat exists or not. AT&T makes AI seem so benign, but isn't that the same company that created the robot that won on Jeopardy?
mpouraryan
8/24/2017 11:29:54 AM User Rank Platinum
Re: One "Humble "Suggestion....
No..that was IBM's Watson. Tell her this; We survived Spreadsheets--we will survive AI.
 elizabethv
8/25/2017 8:16:42 AM User Rank Platinum
Re: One "Humble "Suggestion....
@mpouraryan - Were there really concerns that we might not survive spreadsheets? An inherent mistrust of computers makes sense. But spreadsheets? I guess it's possible. There was also the whole Y2K thing too.
mpouraryan
8/25/2017 12:28:28 PM User Rank Platinum
Re: One "Humble "Suggestion....
I think you missed my point--yes there were concerns when Lotus 123 first came out--but Accoutants did not wither away--did they? We need to adapt and improvise--as I leave you all also on a side note with this and wish all of you throughout TT a great w-end and a great Sept!!
24% of execs are investing in #AR. This infographic explains why: http://pwc.to/2umDdXm   faryl
8/28/2017 6:21:19 PM User Rank Platinum
Re: One "Humble "Suggestion....
People so often seem to worry that automaton is going to make their jobs unnecessary but, as your Lotus example shows, most often it allows people to do their jobs better by providing them more robust tools.
mpouraryan
8/29/2017 12:25:39 PM User Rank Platinum
Re: One "Humble "Suggestion....
As I am making the "final rounds" for the month, I am seeing watching live feed as the President is arriving in Texas. What I hope to see is harnessing the power of AI For the good that is critical--as for the Sharks, we will be vigliant!!
Onward to September team..as I wish all a great rest of the week. elizabethv
8/30/2017 7:28:49 AM User Rank Platinum
Re: One "Humble "Suggestion....
Using AI for good - like what's happening in Texas right now would be amazing! I would just prefer it not be in the form of self-controlled semi trucks taking loads of supplies for those in need. Semi trucks scare me enough without them lacking an actual driver. Even if it could potentially mean more aid for victims.
 dcawrey
8/30/2017 11:39:10 AM User Rank Platinum
Re: One "Humble "Suggestion....
@elizabethv For all the criticism that AI could be used for nefarious purposes, I think AI can do more help. Great to see people highlighting the beneficial side of artificial intelligence.
mpouraryan
9/1/2017 11:10:32 AM User Rank Platinum
Re: One "Humble "Suggestion....
Your very fears are about to be realized as the UK, for instance, has approved Self Driving Trucks:
http://www.wired.co.uk/article/uk-trial-self-driving-trucks-platoons-roads Whether we like it or not, it is here--the question is where do we go from here in this quest for Automation--especially on this labor day w-end? Onward to September as I wish all a fab and restful labor day w-end for all in the US. Ariella
9/7/2017 1:53:36 PM User Rank Author
Re: One "Humble "Suggestion....
@mpouraryan not to be outodne, in the US, Reuters reports, Lyft is set to offer self-driving rides --for FREE:
Lyft said on Thursday that self-driving cars will soon be dispatched to certain passengers who request a ride through the app in the area. The cars will come from Drive.ai, a Mountain View, California, startup that builds software to turn cars into autonomous vehicles. It is the latest in a string of partnerships between Lyft and an autonomous car company, but it is the one with the most immediate impact to Lyft passengers. There will be initially a small number of cars available, said Drive.ai Co-founder and President Carol Reiley, each with a trained driver in the front seat in case something goes wrong. "We want to make sure the experience feels as much like an autonomous vehicle experience as possible," Reiley said. Passengers must choose to opt into the program and the rides are free. mpouraryan
9/7/2017 2:00:42 PM User Rank Platinum
Re: One "Humble "Suggestion....
THanks for the guidance--I am aware of it--and Lyft, as I am sure you're aware, has a few key backers including GM. But, our enthuisiasm should be temepred by what Elon Musk noted as to underscore the fact that AI may lead to War--something I have noted in my comments...what I'd like to call the "Battlestar Gallatica" syndrom--Facebook's shutting down the Machine Langugages a few weeks back is an indication.....
 mhhf1ve
9/7/2017 2:03:40 PM User Rank Platinum
Re: One "Humble "Suggestion....
I have to agree with Elon Musk.. that AI should be regulated before it's "too late" -- and the disruption surprises us. It's one thing for the industrial revolution to create pollution that we can (kind of) clean up over many decades, but the side effects of AI might be much worse for us (esp if we have no way to "clean it up").
mpouraryan
9/7/2017 2:19:25 PM User Rank Platinum
Re: One "Humble "Suggestion....
It is imperative that we remain in charge no matter what. That's the lessons to be learnt....
mhhf1ve
9/7/2017 2:01:30 PM User Rank Platinum
Re: One "Humble "Suggestion....
A *FREE* Lyft ride in an autonomous car?!? We are truly living in the future, even though the cars aren't flying yet.
I wonder if Google will try an April Fool's day prank like this: http://www.cnn.com/2017/08/08/us/driverless-car-mystery-trnd/index.html (where a human driver is actually disguised as an empty seat...) Ariella
9/7/2017 2:05:21 PM User Rank Author
Re: One "Humble "Suggestion....
@mhhf1ve I remember reading about those faked driverles cars. So would you take a free Lyft ride to serve as a guinea pig for driverless cars?
mhhf1ve
9/7/2017 2:46:59 PM User Rank Platinum
Re: One "Humble "Suggestion....
Heh. I'd certainly take a free ride in an autonomous car right now.. when there are still professional drivers behind the wheel that can at least try to take over if something goes wrong.
I don't know if I'd trust a long-distance trip, though... and there would have to be a LOT more data showing that autonomous cars are better before it becomes legal, anyway. These tests are all baby steps, but I think it'll work someday. Maybe humans won't be allowed to drive in our lifetime? All autonomous cars on the road is probably safer than some mix of human and robots.... Ariella
9/7/2017 2:49:53 PM User Rank Author
Re: One "Humble "Suggestion....
@mhhf1ve < All autonomous cars on the road is probably safer than some mix of human and robots.... > Agreed, and I know that at least one of my kids would prefer to be driven in an autonomous car to driving herself.
mhhf1ve
9/7/2017 5:18:57 PM User Rank Platinum
Re: One "Humble "Suggestion....
Assuming autonomous cars are as safe as human drivers (i.e., not perfect but causing less than x deaths per mile driven), who wouldn't prefer an AV to driving themselves? Add on that AVs might obviate the need to own the whole car entirely, and it could be much cheaper and more efficient to let robots take us everywhere.
Ariella
9/7/2017 5:37:25 PM User Rank Author
Re: One "Humble "Suggestion....
@mhhf1ve Some people enjoy the experience of driving. Certainly, someone who buys something like a Ferrari probably is not just thinking about the safest ride possible but the most fun ride possible -- with him/herself in control of it.
mhhf1ve
9/7/2017 9:18:45 PM User Rank Platinum
Re: One "Humble "Suggestion....
Ok, but even people who own Ferraris drive them on closed tracks and not on public roads when they want to really have fun. I imagine the same thing that happened to horses will happen to traditional cars -- they will still be used but mostly for recreational purposes.
Ariella
9/7/2017 10:00:25 PM User Rank Author
Re: One "Humble "Suggestion....
@mhhf1ve I'm not sure that will happen -- at least not in the next 75 years. Even when cars replaced horses, people were still the ones driving. And even forms of transportation that could have been supplanted by technology -- like bicyles -- are still around and even used for commuting at present.
mhhf1ve
9/7/2017 10:33:22 PM User Rank Platinum
Re: One "Humble "Suggestion....
I think it was Kevin Kelly who said no technology ever dies. There are only a few examples where a tool was so toxic/dangerous that it was never used again after being invented. E.g. Radioactive paint for clock hands....
So I'm sure dumb cars will exist for as long as civilization does. But AVs will likely take over someday when they get smart enough.
mhhf1ve
9/7/2017 10:40:34 PM User Rank Platinum
Re: One "Humble "Suggestion....
If autonomous software actually becomes common, maybe we'll also have autonomous bikes? I think there was one autonomous motorcycle entry in the DARPA Grand Challenge that started the autonomous car boom...
Ariella
9/8/2017 8:18:36 AM User Rank Author
Re: One "Humble "Suggestion....
@mhhf1ve you mean a motorized bike or one that still needed human power for pedaling? It would be odd to still have to pedal but have the bike decide where to go. Now if it's an autonomous motorcyle, it would likely not be too popular because the riders rarely abide by the strict rules of the road. They do ride between lanes to get ahead of traffic, for example, something that autonmous driving programming would probably disallow.
mhhf1ve
9/8/2017 11:11:54 AM User Rank Platinum
Re: One "Humble "Suggestion....
You don't think anyone would want to pedal on a "stationary bike" that autonomously drove itself to where you wanted to go? :)
mpouraryan
9/7/2017 2:12:56 PM User Rank Platinum
Re: One "Humble "Suggestion....
Knowing Google, You'll never know.
But the idea of it is here--whether we like it or not. ..and the challenges it represents is quite a spectacle to be witness to. afwriter
8/25/2017 1:55:08 PM User Rank Platinum
Re: One "Humble "Suggestion....
I have a friend that is so scared by AI that she gets noticeably jittery when people bring it up.
faryl
8/28/2017 6:00:39 PM User Rank Platinum
Re: One "Humble "Suggestion....
Oh no! Hopefully she doesn't read too much about it - it's probably used for more products/services she uses than she realizes!
afwriter
8/29/2017 10:24:28 AM User Rank Platinum
Re: One "Humble "Suggestion....
I think that when she thinks about AI her mind immediately goes to robot overlords and not a call center in Decatur, Illinois
faryl
8/31/2017 2:37:28 PM User Rank Platinum
Re: One "Humble "Suggestion....
@afwriter Frankly, I'm thinking robot overlords might be more empathetic/helpful than many of the humans working at call centers. :)
elizabethv
8/25/2017 8:07:10 AM User Rank Platinum
Re: One "Humble "Suggestion....
@Ariella - I would think that would be something Elon Musk would need, with Tesla cars. Given that you can't really predict every possible variable one might see on the road, but you can predict generic situations, whose reactions required would be the same. So self-automation that can react in a way it is programmed to, to circumstances that are new, only makes sense.
Ariella
8/25/2017 10:17:12 AM User Rank Author
Re: One "Humble "Suggestion....
@elizabethv Yes, the programming for self-driving cars needs to operate on AI.
 Mike Robuck
8/25/2017 10:46:58 AM User Rank Author
Re: One "Humble "Suggestion....
I can see self driving cars in urban areas, but I think we're a long ways away from seeing them in rural areas that barely have good broadband now.
afwriter
8/25/2017 1:57:02 PM User Rank Platinum
Re: One "Humble "Suggestion....
@Mike that just made me think; Why stop at self-driving cars? Could we see self-driving Tractors or similar farm equipment in the future when networks can support it?
faryl
8/28/2017 6:03:25 PM User Rank Platinum
Re: One "Humble "Suggestion....
Especially rural areas with kangaroos!
https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2017/jul/01/volvo-admits-its-self-driving-cars-are-confused-by-kangaroos
elizabethv
8/29/2017 8:53:50 AM User Rank Platinum
Re: One "Humble "Suggestion....
@faryl - that's amazing! I want to see a self-automated car get confused by a kangaroo! That sounds like a life dream type goal right there!
faryl
8/31/2017 6:04:26 PM User Rank Platinum
Re: One "Humble "Suggestion....
@elizabethtv I thought it was pretty funny too! Sounds like if they can't resolve this, either Australia will be late in getting self-driving cars, or kangaroos might need to learn to be smarter than cars and stay out of the way!
 clrmoney
8/22/2017 7:39:33 PM User Rank Platinum
Goal for AI is Automation
You would think AI/Artificial Intelligence would already have automation like the robots or something. So with them having this will open doors for more things they would like to do.
Ariella
8/23/2017 9:27:53 AM User Rank Author
Re: Goal for AI is Automation
@clmoney there already are robots in operation in industry. What is rarer is the closed loop system in which everything operates on its own without people getting involved even for maintenance and repairs.
afwriter
8/23/2017 11:58:00 PM User Rank Platinum
Re: Goal for AI is Automation
Taking out the human element altogether seems like a recipe for disaster. Imagine the episode of I love Lucy with the Chocolates on the conveyor belt only without a human to know something is going wrong.
elizabethv
8/25/2017 8:12:45 AM User Rank Platinum
Re: Goal for AI is Automation
@afwriter - that's a really good analogy. Though, maybe a robot can test the chemical make up of candy, to ensure it's accurate. And when they envitably are made incorrectly, it isn't a robot, no matter how sophisticated the machines might be. Sometimes, a human is just necessary.
faryl
8/28/2017 6:06:25 PM User Rank Platinum
Re: Goal for AI is Automation
Agreed. Especially since the human element is used to develop those systems ... which just increases the likelihood of something going wrong.
srufolo1
8/23/2017 10:26:56 PM User Rank Platinum
AT&T's Gilbert: The Goal of AI is Automation
The way Gilbert puts it, AI is not there to destroy but to "help us humans do our jobs better." I think maybe we are overeacting to what AI is capable of. It's kind of they way we looked at Y2K before we entered the 2000s.
afwriter
8/23/2017 11:49:50 PM User Rank Platinum
Re: AT&T's Gilbert: The Goal of AI is Automation
@Srufolo1, You're probably right, but I have seen way too many SciFi movies not to be cautious. On a side note, I have seen way too many shark movies to go in the ocean as well.
srufolo1
8/24/2017 8:23:47 AM User Rank Platinum
Re: AT&T's Gilbert: The Goal of AI is Automation
@afwriter I know. Terminator is a terrific example of what can go awry when computers start learning about AI themselves. But it's just a movie. May I point to my favorite SciFi flick? Soylent Green. There's an example of paranoia to the max. Although I have to say, people seem to be disappearing in my community lately.
Ariella
8/24/2017 9:13:10 AM User Rank Author
Re: AT&T's Gilbert: The Goal of AI is Automation
<You're probably right, but I have seen way too many SciFi movies not to be cautious. On a side note, I have seen way too many shark movies to go in the ocean as well. >
LOL @afwriter. You notice how scientist persist in doing exactly the things that sci-fi movies show end in disaster like this: http://www.businessinsider.com/peter-thiel-funded-de-extinction-animal-resurrection-woolly-mammoth-2017-6 As for shark attacks, you must have seen the stats on that, including the greater odds of being killed by a domestic animal. Here's a fun take on the topic: https://thefisheriesblog.com/2015/04/27/shark-attack/ afwriter
8/25/2017 2:00:57 PM User Rank Platinum
Re: AT&T's Gilbert: The Goal of AI is Automation
Thanks for the links, de-extinction, while incredibly intriguing, can't lead to anything good. Whether those animals were made to be extinct or not the world has gone on without them and reintroducing them could mess with the ecosystem. To quote Jurrassic Park and bring the topic back to AI, They were so busy wondering if they could they didn't stop to think if they should.
Ariella
8/25/2017 2:07:14 PM User Rank Author
Re: AT&T's Gilbert: The Goal of AI is Automation
@afwriter Exactly! Really, the idea goes all the way back to Mary Shelley's Frankenstein. Tampering with nature's own life forms always leads to disaster.
srufolo1
8/25/2017 8:51:36 PM User Rank Platinum
Re: AT&T's Gilbert: The Goal of AI is Automation
This whole notion of extinction and de-extinction intrigues me. Humans are blamed for the extinction of many animals. Are we responsible for saving them then, such as all the effort being put into saving Pandas, or are these animals meant to become extinct? At one time they said Buffalo were extinct because of the Native Americans hunting them, but they still exist. How did they become de-extinct?
afwriter
8/25/2017 9:25:28 PM User Rank Platinum
Re: AT&T's Gilbert: The Goal of AI is Automation
To again quote Jurassic Park, life finds a way. They find species all the
time that have been declared extinct but pop up sometimes a hundred years later. faryl
8/28/2017 6:16:02 PM User Rank Platinum
Re: AT&T's Gilbert: The Goal of AI is Automation
I think buffalo were pushed to the brink of extinction by the introduction of commercial hunting/fire arms as well as the military targeting bison to provide more land for cattle and to reduce the Native American populations. (If I remember it right - prior to European settlers, indigenous people killed what they could use, so didn't create a threat of instinction)
They survived because some private citizens bought & protected some herds & the National Park system created a reserve as well.
(So that seems to be an example where humans were both the cause of (near) extinction and for saving the species from that extinction.
Often it's something as simple as humans destroying the natural habitats or part of a species food chain that causes extinction or threatens a species.
srufolo1
8/29/2017 7:32:33 PM User Rank Platinum
Re: AT&T's Gilbert: The Goal of AI is Automation
@faryl I like your historical facts on the near extinction of buffalo. I do remember learning that Native Americans killed and used what they needed, like skins and meat. I learned in grade school that buffalo were extinct, and was surprised when I was in high school to see a farm near my house in Pennsylvania that had buffalo.
faryl
8/31/2017 4:11:23 AM User Rank Platinum
Re: AT&T's Gilbert: The Goal of AI is Automation
@srufolo1 I remember someone telling me that there were buffalo in Golden Gate Park and thinking they were joking. In my mind, I imagined them roaming around - the reality was a little less exciting, but still kind of cool
srufolo1
8/31/2017 9:47:41 PM User Rank Platinum
Re: AT&T's Gilbert: The Goal of AI is Automation
@faryl So funny. When someone told me there were buffalo, I pictured them roaming around too! But they were so cool to see on that farm there. Really buffalo remind me of what America used to be a long, long time ago.
faryl
8/28/2017 6:18:50 PM User Rank Platinum
Re: AT&T's Gilbert: The Goal of AI is Automation
You definitely want to avoid the ocean in SoCal then! It seems the warming waters have been attracting more sharks - and they come pretty close to the shore!
faryl
8/31/2017 6:09:52 PM User Rank Platinum
Re: AT&T's Gilbert: The Goal of AI is Automation
I recently read that one of the larger tech companies shut down one of their AI programs because it seemed to be getting "too smart". I'll try to find a link & post it if I can.
mpouraryan
9/1/2017 6:22:46 PM User Rank Platinum
Re: AT&T's Gilbert: The Goal of AI is Automation
On a brief "late prowl" as I wanted to note that the company was Facebook..but wanted to leave you all w/this as I wish you all in the US a great and fab Labor day w-end:
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